John 7:28 Ye both know me,

Spoken to
audience

The crowd said that no one should know where the Anointed should come from.

KJV

John 7:28 Ye both know me, and ye know whence I am: and I am not come of myself, but he that sent me is true, whom ye know not.

NIV

John 7:28 Yes, you know me, and you know where I am from. I am not here on my own authority, but he who sent me is true. You do not know him,

LISTENERS HEARD

And have you seen me, and you have seen where I am from, and I haven't started from myself. Instead he is true, the one sending me whom you yourselves have not seen.

MY TAKE

We can know where people are from and still not see them clearly.

LOST IN TRANSLATION

All the verbs here except "I am" are in the past, perfect tense. The verb translated multiple times as "know" is in the perfect tense "have seen." While the verb translated as "know" can be translated this way, it primarily means "see" or "perceive." Jesus tends to use it when he uses the word translated as "true" because that word means "not hidden."

# KJV TRANSLATION ISSUES
11
  • WW - Wrong Word -- The word translated as "both" should be something more like "and."
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "know" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have seen."
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "know" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have seen."
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "am" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have."
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "of" does not capture the specific meaning of the word.
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "but" does not capture the specific meaning of the word.
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "he" does not capture the specific meaning of the word.
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "that" doesn't exist in the source.
  • WF - Wrong Form -  The "sent" is not an active verb but a participle, "sending."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "yourselves" is not shown in the English translation, but it is needed to capture the pronoun as well as the form of the verb.
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "know" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have seen."
# NIV TRANSLATION ISSUES
15
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "yes" doesn't exist in the source.
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "and" is not shown in the English translation.
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "know" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have seen."
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "know" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have seen."
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "am" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have."
  • WW - Wrong Word -- The word translated as "here" should be something more like "have come."
  • WW - Wrong Word -- The word translated as "on" should be something more like "away from."
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "authority" doesn't exist in the source.
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "but" does not capture the specific meaning of the word.
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "he" does not capture the specific meaning of the word.
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "who" doesn't exist in the source.
  • WF - Wrong Form -  The "sent" is not an active verb but a participle, "sending."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "yourselves" is not shown in the English translation, but it is needed to capture the pronoun as well as the form of the verb.
  • WT - Wrong Tense - The English verb "know" is the present tense, but Greek is in the past perfect, a completed action, "have seen."
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "him" does not capture the specific meaning of the word.
EACH WORD of KJV

Ye -- This is from the second-person, plural form of the verb.

both -- (WW) This is a contraction meaning "and me." It begins the sentence with an "and." The ka- represents the "and" part, which can be translated as "also."

know -- (WT) The word translated as "know" means primarily "to see" and is used to mean "know' as we use the word "see" to mean "know" in English. It's tense is the past perfect, "have known" or, more accurately, "have seen."

me, -- This is from the contraction that begins the sentence.

and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also").

ye -- This is from the second-person, plural form of the verb.

know -- (WT) The word translated as "know" means primarily "to see" and is used to mean "know' as we use the word "see" to mean "know" in English. It's tense is the past perfect, "have known" or, more accurately, "have seen."

whence -- "Whence" is from an adverb which means "whence" and "from what source."

I -- This is from the first-person, singular form of the verb.

am: -- The verb "am" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics.

and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also").

I -- This is from the first-person, singular form of the verb.

am -- (WT) This helping verb indicates the present tense of the verb. It's tense is the past perfect, "have come" or, more accurately, "have shown up."

not  -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. Adding "really" to the sentence captures the same idea. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words.

come -- The word translated as "come" primarily means "to start out" but Christ usually uses it to mean "come" but not always. It indicates movement, especially its beginning, without indicating a direction toward or away from anything, so it works either as "start," "come," or "go," but it is more like our phrase "being underway." Our English word "show up" captures both the "start" and "come" ideas. See this article for more. Here, however, "start" works better because Jesus is talking about his origin.

of -- (CW) The word translated as "of" means "from" in both locations and when referring to a source or a cause. It also means the instrument "by" which a thing is done and "away from."

myself, -- The Greek reflexive pronoun is translated as myself.

but -- (CW) The Greek word translated as "but" denotes an exception or simple opposition. It is used to emphasize the contrast between things like we use "instead," "but instead,"or "rather." It is not the common word usually translated as "but." It is the Greek word "other" like we use "otherwise." Jesus often uses this conjunction to connect a negative clause, not doing something, with a positive one, "instead do this."

he -- (CW) The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article, without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. This is not the pronoun used for "he."

that -- (IW) There is nothing that can be translated as "that" in the Greek source.

sent -- (WF) "Sent" is from a Greek verb that means "send," "send forth," "send away," "conduct," and "escort." This is the second most common word Jesus uses that is translated as "send out," but this one doesn't have the prefix that has the sense of "out." This is not an active verb but a participle.

me -- "Me" is the regular first-person pronoun in Greek as the object of the verb or preposition.

is -- The verb "is" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics. With the genitive object, the sense is "belongs to."

true,   - - "True" is an adjective that means "truthful" and "trustworthy" when applied to a person, "true" and "genuine" when applied to objects and as an adverb "really" and honestly."

whom -- The word translated as "whom" is a demonstrative pronoun ("this" "that"), but it often acts as a pronoun "which," "what," "who," "whosoever," "where," "for which reason," and many similar meanings.

ye --  The pronoun "you" is used explicitly as the subject of the sentence. Since it is already part of the verb, its use here creates emphasis on the "you" as we might say "you yourselves." It is plural.

missing "yourselves" -- (MW)  The subjective pronoun repeats the information in the verb so it should be repeated in English like "you yourselves."

know -- (WT) The word translated as "know" means primarily "to see" and is used to mean "know' as we use the word "see" to mean "know" in English. It's tense is the past perfect, "have known" or, more accurately, "have seen."

not. -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. Adding "really" to the sentence captures the same idea. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words.

EACH WORD of NIV

Yes, -- (IW) There is nothing that can be translated as "yes" in the Greek source.

missing "and"  -- (MW) The untranslated word  "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also"). It starts this verse in a contraction of "and me."

you -- This is from the second-person, plural form of the verb.

know -- (WT) The word translated as "know" means primarily "to see" and is used to mean "know' as we use the word "see" to mean "know" in English. It's tense is the past perfect, "have known" or, more accurately, "have seen."

me, -- This is from the contraction that begins the sentence.

and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also").

you -- This is from the second-person, plural form of the verb.

know -- (WT) The word translated as "know" means primarily "to see" and is used to mean "know' as we use the word "see" to mean "know" in English. It's tense is the past perfect, "have known" or, more accurately, "have seen."

where -- "Where" is from an adverb which means "whence" and "from what source."

I -- This is from the first-person, singular form of the verb.

am: -- The verb "am" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics.

from -- This finishes the word translated as "where."

and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also").

I -- This is from the first-person, singular form of the verb.

am -- (WT) This helping verb indicates the present tense of the verb. It's tense is the past perfect, "have come" or, more accurately, "have shown up."

not  -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. Adding "really" to the sentence captures the same idea. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words.

here -- (WW) The word translated as "come" primarily means "to start out" but Christ usually uses it to mean "come" but not always. It indicates movement, especially its beginning, without indicating a direction toward or away from anything, so it works either as "start," "come," or "go," but it is more like our phrase "being underway." Our English word "show up" captures both the "start" and "come" ideas. See this article for more. Here, however, "start" works better because Jesus is talking about his origin.

on -- (WW) The word translated as "on" means "from" in both locations and when referring to a source or a cause. It also means the instrument "by" which a thing is done and "away from."

 my own , --  The Greek reflexive pronoun is translated as myself.

authority, -- (IW) There is nothing that can be translated as "authority" in the Greek source.

but -- (CW) The Greek word translated as "but" denotes an exception or simple opposition. It is used to emphasize the contrast between things like we use "instead," "but instead,"or "rather." It is not the common word usually translated as "but." It is the Greek word "other" like we use "otherwise." Jesus often uses this conjunction to connect a negative clause, not doing something, with a positive one, "instead do this."

he -- (CW) The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article, without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. This is not the pronoun used for "he."

who -- (IW) There is nothing that can be translated as "who " in the Greek source.

sent -- (WF) "Sent" is from a Greek verb that means "send," "send forth," "send away," "conduct," and "escort." This is the second most common word Jesus uses that is translated as "send out," but this one doesn't have the prefix that has the sense of "out." This is not an active verb but a participle.

me -- "Me" is the regular first-person pronoun in Greek as the object of the verb or preposition.

is -- The verb "is" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics. With the genitive object, the sense is "belongs to."

true,   - - "True" is an adjective that means "truthful" and "trustworthy" when applied to a person, "true" and "genuine" when applied to objects and as an adverb "really" and honestly."

You --  The pronoun "you" is used explicitly as the subject of the sentence. Since it is already part of the verb, its use here creates emphasis on the "you" as we might say "you yourselves." It is plural.

missing "yourselves" -- (MW)  The subjective pronoun repeats the information in the verb so it should be repeated in English like "you yourselves."

do -- This English helping verb is used to create questions, commands, negative statements, and smooth word flow in translation from Greek

not. -- The Greek word translated as "not" is the Greek negative used to deny objective facts, not opinions. It means "no," "not," or"no truly." It makes a negative statement of fact. Adding "really" to the sentence captures the same idea. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause. When it precedes other words, its force is limited to those words.

know -- (WT) The word translated as "know" means primarily "to see" and is used to mean "know' as we use the word "see" to mean "know" in English. It's tense is the past perfect, "have known" or, more accurately, "have seen."

him-- (CW) The word translated as "him" is a demonstrative pronoun ("this" "that"), but it often acts as a pronoun "which," "what," "who," "whosoever," "where," "for which reason," and many similar meanings. It is not the pronoun "him."

COMPARISON: GREEK to KJV

Κἀμὲ [34 verses]  (conj + pron 1st sg masc acc) "And...I" is kago, a contraction of kai-ego. It also appears as a contraction of other forms of the pronoun, kamoi (dative) and kame (acc). "And" is kai-, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just." "I" is -ego, which is the first-person singular pronoun meaning "I." It also means "I at least," "for my part," "indeed," and "for myself." --

οἴδατε [38 verses] (2nd pl perf ind act) "Ye know" is oida which is a form of eido (ἴδω) which means "to see," "to examine," "to perceive," "to behold," "to know how to do," "to see with the mind's eye," and "to know."

καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

οἴδατε [38 verses] (2nd pl perf ind act) "Ye know" is oida which is a form of eido (ἴδω) which means "to see," "to examine," "to perceive," "to behold," "to know how to do," "to see with the mind's eye," and "to know."

πόθεν [9 verses](adv indeclform) "Whence" is from pothen, which means "whence" and "from what source."

εἰμί:[614 verses](1st sg pres ind act) "I am from" is eimi, which means "to be," "to exist," "to be the case," of circumstance and events "to happen,"  and "is possible." With the genitive object, the sense is "belongs to." It can also mean "must" with a dative.

καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

ἀπ᾽ [190 verses]​(prep) "From" is apo, a preposition of separation which means "from" or "away from" from when referring to place or motion, "from" or "after" when referring to time, "from" as an origin or cause. It also means the instrument "by" which a thing is done.  Usually takes the genitive object.

ἐμαυτοῦ [15 verses] (pron sg masc gen) ") "Myself" is emautou, which means "of me," and "of myself".

οὐκ [269 verses](partic) "Not" is ou , the negative adverb for facts and statements, negating both single words and sentences.  The other negative adverb, μή applies to will and thought; οὐ denies, μή rejects; οὐ is absolute, μή relative; οὐ objective, μή subjective.

ἐλήλυθα, [198 verses](1st sg perf ind act) "I am come"is  erchomai, which means "to start," "to set out," "to come," "to go," and any kind of motion. It means both "to go" on a journey and "to arrive" at a place.

ἀλλ᾽ [154 verses](conj) "But" is alla, which means "otherwise," "but," "still," "at least," "except," "yet," nevertheless," "rather," "moreover," and "nay."

ἐστίν.[614 verses](3rd sg pres ind act) "Is" is eimi, which means "to be," "to exist," "to be the case," of circumstance and events "to happen,"  and "is possible." With the genitive object, the sense is "belongs to." It can also mean "must" with a dative.

ἀληθινὸς [8 verses](adj sg masc nom) "True" is from alethinos, which is an adjective that means "truthful" and "trustworthy" when applied to a person, "true" and "genuine" when applied to objects and as an adverb "really" and "honestly."

[821 verses](article sg masc nom)  "Whom" is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the"). 

πέμψας [39 verses](part sg aor act masc nom) "He sent forth" is pempo, which means "send," "send forth," "send away," "conduct," and "escort."

με, [49 verses](pron 1st sg masc acc) "Me" is eme, which is the objective first-person, objective, singular pronoun that means  "me."

ὃν [294 verses](pron sg masc acc)" Whom" is hos, which means "this," "that," "he," "she," "which," "what," "who," "whosoever," "where," "for which reason," and many similar meanings.

ὑμεῖς [92 verses](pron 2nd pl nom) "You" is hymeis (humeis), which is the plural nominative form of the second person, "you."

οὐκ [269 verses](partic) "Not" is ou , the negative adverb for facts and statements, negating both single words and sentences.  The other negative adverb, μή applies to will and thought; οὐ denies, μή rejects; οὐ is absolute, μή relative; οὐ objective, μή subjective.

οἴδατε [38 verses] (2nd pl perf ind act) "Ye know" is oida which is a form of eido (ἴδω) which means "to see," "to examine," "to perceive," "to behold," "to know how to do," "to see with the mind's eye," and "to know."

Wordplay

 A play on "seeing" and the word for true which means "not hidden." 

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