Luke 8:7 And some fell among thorns;

Spoken to
audience

A parable at a gathering of people from every city.

KJV

Luke 8:7 And some fell among thorns; and the thorns sprang up with it, and choked it.

NIV

Luke 8:7 Other seed fell among thorns, which grew up with it and choked the plants.

LISTENERS HEARD

And another fell in among the thorns and, being made to grow together, the thorns suffocated it.

MY TAKE

We don't want to grow up among suffocating people.

GREEK ORDER

καὶ   ἕτερον  ἔπεσεν ἐν μέσῳ   τῶν ἀκανθῶν, καὶ  συνφυεῖσαι                              αἱ ἄκανθαι ἀπέπνιξαν αὐτό.
And another fell       in among the thorns       and, being made to grow together, the thorns   choked      it.

LOST IN TRANSLATION

Luke still adds in a unique word, meaning "being made to grow together." It is a passive participle, not the active verb as translated. A word meaning "middle" is ignored in translation, best translated as "among" here. Again, this verse is written about a single seed, not the plural seeds in the other versions. The word translated as "choked" primarily means "suffocate," which is more dramatic and more humorous, like being around sufficating people.

# KJV TRANSLATION ISSUES
7
  • WN  --Wrong Number- The word "some" is translated as plural but the Greek word is singular.
  • CW --Confusing Word -- This is not the common word usually translated as "some."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "among" is not shown in the English translation.
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "the/this" before "thorns" is not shown in the English translation.
  • WF -- Wrong Form -  This is not an active verb but a participle, a verbal adjective, ending with "-ing. " 
  • WV --Wrong Voice - The verb here is translated as passive but it is active.
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "and" doesn't exist in the source.
# NIV TRANSLATION ISSUES
9
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "and" is not shown in the English translation.
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "among" is not shown in the English translation.
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "and" is not shown in the English translation.
  • WW --Wrong Word -- The word translated as "which" should be something more like "the."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "thorns" is not shown in the English translation.
  • WF -- Wrong Form -  This "grew up" is not an active verb but a participle, a verbal adjective, ending with "-ing. " 
  • WV --Wrong Voice - The verb here is translated as passive but it is active.
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "and" doesn't exist in the source.
  • WW --Wrong Word -- The word translated as "the" should be something more like "it."
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "plants" doesn't exist in the source.
EACH WORD of KJV

And -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

some -- (CW, WN)) The word translated as "some" means "one of two," "other," "another," or "different." It is an adjective used as a noun. This word is not plural but singular.

fell -- "Fall" is translated from a Greek word that means "to fall" and "to fall down." It is the root word for dozens of Greek terms involving moving from a higher state to a lower one. Like our word "to fall" it has a number of special meanings including "to fall into a given class," "to prostrate," "to fall from power," "to perish," and so on.

among   -- The word translated as "in" means "in," "within," "with" (an instrument), "by" (near), "by" (means of), "during" (time),  or "among"  with an indirect-object form object.  With the direct object form, it means "into," "on," and "for." When referring to time, it means "during." It can mean "on," "at," or "by" in the sense of "near."

missing "among"  -- (MW) The untranslated word  "middle" but has a lot of special meanings with different prepositions. One of those with the "in" is "offer for competition" and "middle point." It also means "difference."

missing "the/this"  -- (MW) The untranslated word is the Greek definite article," the," which usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," and "those"). See this article for more. 

thorns; -- The Greek words translated as "thorns" and "thistles" both mean any type of thorny plant. As in English, the term "thorny" is used as a metaphor for "difficult", "tricky," or "painful" as in "a thorny question." In Jewish tradition, thorns did not exist in the original creation but were created after humanity's fall.

and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

the -- The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article, "the," which usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. 

thorns -- The Greek words translated as "thorns" and "thistles" both mean any type of thorny plant. As in English, the term "thorny" is used as a metaphor for "difficult", "tricky," or "painful" as in "a thorny question." In Jewish tradition, thorns did not exist in the original creation but were created after humanity's fall.

sprang up   - (WF, WV)  "Sprung up" is a unique word, used only here in the NT. It is a different word than the one used in Matthew and Mark. It is also different but related to the word used in the previous verse. This word means "made to grow together". This is not an active verb but a participle and passive, a verbal adjective, ending with "-ing. "  

with it, - This completes the meaning of the verb. It is from the prefix. It is from the prefic meaning "together"

and -- (IW) This word is not in the Greek source. It was added because the previous verb was translated as active rather than as a participle.

choked - "Choked" is a verb that means "to choke," "to suffocate," and "to be drowned." As in English, it is used to denote being choked with rage or annoyance.

it. -- The word translated as "it" is the Greek word commonly translated as third-person pronouns in English.  Here it is neuter in the form of a subject or object of a verb or preposition.  

EACH WORD of NIV

missing "and"  -- (MW) The untranslated word "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

Other --   The word translated as "some" means "one of two," "other," "another," or "different." It is an adjective used as a noun.

fell -- "Fall" is translated from a Greek word that means "to fall" and "to fall down." It is the root word for dozens of Greek terms involving moving from a higher state to a lower one. Like our word "to fall" it has a number of special meanings including "to fall into a given class," "to prostrate," "to fall from power," "to perish," and so on.

among   -- The word translated as "in" means "in," "within," "with" (an instrument), "by" (near), "by" (means of), "during" (time),  or "among"  with an indirect-object form object.  With the direct object form, it means "into," "on," and "for." When referring to time, it means "during." It can mean "on," "at," or "by" in the sense of "near."

missing "among"  -- (MW) The untranslated word  "among" but has a lot of special meanings with different prepositions. One of those with the "in" is "offer for competition" and "middle point." It also means "difference."

missing "the/this"  -- (MW) The untranslated word is the Greek definite article," the," which usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," and "those"). See this article for more. 

thorns; -- The Greek words translated as "thorns" and "thistles" both mean any type of thorny plant. As in English, the term "thorny" is used as a metaphor for "difficult", "tricky," or "painful" as in "a thorny question." In Jewish tradition, thorns did not exist in the original creation but were created after humanity's fall.

missing "and"  -- (MW) The untranslated word "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

which -- (WW) The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article, "the," which usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. 

missing "thorns"  -- (MW) The untranslated word  "thorns" and "thistles" both mean any type of thorny plant. As in English, the term "thorny" is used as a metaphor for "difficult", "tricky," or "painful" as in "a thorny question." In Jewish tradition, thorns did not exist in the original creation but were created after humanity's fall.

grew up  - (WF, WV)  "Grew up" is a unique word, used only here in the NT. It is a different word than the one used in Matthew and Mark. It is also different but related to the word used in the previous verse. This word means "made to grow together". This is not an active verb but a participle and passive, a verbal adjective, ending with "-ing. " 

with it, - This completes the meaning of the verb. It is from the prefix. It is from the prefic meaning "together"

and -- (IW) This word is not in the Greek source. It was added because the previous verb was translated as active rather than as a participle.

choked - "Choked" is a verb that means "to choke," "to suffocate," and "to be drowned." As in English, it is used to denote being choked with rage or annoyance.

the -- The word translated as "the" is the Greek word commonly translated as third-person pronouns in English.  Here it is neuter in the form of a subject or object of a verb or preposition.  

plants.-- (IW) This word is not in the Greek source.

 

COMPARISON: GREEK to KJV

καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just." In a series, it can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as." -

ἕτερον [21 verses](adj sg masc acc) "Some"is heteros, which means "one or the other of two," "the second," "the secondary," "the minor," "other things [of like kind]," "another," "different," "other than," "different from," "other than should be," and "in another or a different way." As an adverb, it means "in one or the other way," "differently," "otherwise than should be," "badly," and "wrongly."

ἔπεσεν, [36 verses] (verb 3rd sg aor ind act) "Fell" is pipto, which means "to fall," "to fall down," "to be cast down," "fall upon," "intersect (geometry)," "meet," "pass through," "fall violently upon," "attack," "fall in battle," "sink{in water)," "fall short i.e. fail," " fall out of," "lose a thing," "escape from," "fall asleep," "to be accessible to perception," "to fall (between her feet, i.e. to be born)," "to let fall[dice)," "turn out," and "fall under (belong to a class)."

ἐν [413 verses](prep) "Among" is en, which means, with its usual indirect (dative) object, "in," "on," "at," "by," "among," "within," "surrounded by," "in one's hands," "in one's power," "during,"  and "with." With a direct (accusative) object, it means "into," "on," and "for." Referring to time, it means. "in the course of" or "during."

μέσῳ [11 verses](adj sg masc dat) Untranslated is mesos,which means "middle", "middle point", "midway between", "offered for competition", "deposited," "by the middle", "by the waist", "impartial", "inter-mediate", "indeterminate", "things indifferent (neither good nor bad)", "middling", "moderate", "midst", "intervening space", "intervening", "difference", "in a moderate degree", "in the mean," and "equator."

τῶν[821 verses](article pl fem gen)  Untranslated is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the"). It usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. When not preceding a a word that can become a noun, takes the meaning of "the one" or, in the plural, "the ones." Proper nouns do normally not take articles but they are needed when the noun ending cannot be changed to show the noun's role in the sentence as an object, indirect object, or genitive (possessive) form. However, the Greek article is very close to "this" so the purpose of an article like this can also be demonstrative. See this article.   -

ἀκανθῶν [8 verses](noun pl fem gen) "Thorns" is akantha, which means "thorn", "prickle," or "any thorny or prickly plant." It is also a metaphor for a "thorny" question.

καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just." In a series, it can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as."

συνφυεῖσαι [1 verse](part sg aor pass fem dat ) "Sprang up" is from symphyo, which means "made to grow together, "unite with", "become assimilated", and "become natural."

αἱ [821 verses](article pl fem nom)  Untranslated is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the"). It usually precedes a noun or changes the word it precedes (adjective, infinitive, participle, etc.) to act like a noun. When not preceding a a word that can become a noun, takes the meaning of "the one" or, in the plural, "the ones." Proper nouns do normally not take articles but they are needed when the noun ending cannot be changed to show the noun's role in the sentence as an object, indirect object, or genitive (possessive) form. However, the Greek article is very close to "this" so the purpose of an article like this can also be demonstrative. See this article.  -

ἄκανθαι [8 verses](noun pl fem nom) "Thorns" is akantha, which means "thorn", "prickle," or "any thorny or prickly plant." It is also a metaphor for a "thorny" question.

ἀπέπνιξαν  [3 verses](verb 3rd pl aor ind act) "Choked" is apopnigô, which "to suffocate," "to choke," "to cut off," "to kill," "to suffocate," and "to be drowned." As in English, the is used to denote being choked with rage or frustration.

αὐτό   [24 verses](pron/adj sg neut nom/acc) "It" is auto, which means "it," the neuter pronoun as a subject or object. It also means "itself," and "the same." When used as a noun, it is preceded by a definite article, and it means "the same." An accusative object indicates movement towards something or a position reached as a result of that movement. Events may show the amount of time

parallel comparison

This verse is closer to the version in Matthew and Mark (Matthew 13:7, Mar 4:7) that the previous verse (Luke 8:6).

Front Page Date