John 6:50 this is the bread which cometh down

Spoken to
audience

After the miracle of the loaves. The topic is now bread and eternal life.

KJV

John 6:50 this is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.

NIV

John 6:50 But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which anyone may eat and not die.

LISTENERS HEARD

This is the loaf, the one from the sky stepping down in order that anyone might eat of from it and might not die.

MY TAKE

We have to consume what is higher to have the possibility of rising higher.

LOST IN TRANSLATION

The Greek says "should not die" or "might not die." The negative only works if this is expressed as an opinion, not a certainty. No English biblical translation makes it clear that this is expressed only as a possibility, not as a promise.

The "coming down" is the present tense, not any form of past tense. So this bread is coming down at the present. If the "bread" refers to Jesus, it doesn't refer to something that he did in the past, but that he is doing down. I suspect that he is referring to his words as in Matthew 4:4, "Man does not life by bread alone, but by every remark."

 

 

# KJV TRANSLATION ISSUES
5
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "which" is not the common word usually translated as "which."
  • WF - Wrong Form -  The "come" is not an active verb but a participle, "coming."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "the" before "heaven" is not shown in the English translation.
  • WW - Wrong Word -- The word translated as "man" should be something more like "someone."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "should" needed from the form of the verb is not shown in the English translation.
# NIV TRANSLATION ISSUES
9
  • IW - Inserted Word -- The word "but" doesn't exist in the source.
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "here" is not the common word usually translated as "here."
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "that" is not the common word usually translated as "that."
  • WF - Wrong Form -  The "come" is not an active verb but a participle, "coming."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "the" before "heaven" is not shown in the English translation.
  • CW - Confusing Word -- The "which" is not the common pronoun usually translated as "which."
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "from" is not shown in the English translation.
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "it" is not shown in the English translation.
  • MW - Missing Word -- The word "should" needed from the form of the verb is not shown in the English translation.
EACH WORD of KJV

this  -- "This" is translated from a Greek adjective that means "this," "that," "the nearer." Without a noun, it has the sense of "this one" or "that one." It is in the form of a subject.

is -- The verb "is" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics.

the -- The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article, without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. 

bread -- The word translated as "bread" means "small loaf or cake of bread." It is more like a slice of bread today. It describes a thin 1/2 inch thick round or an oblong loaf of wheat bread, meant to be torn into pieces and not cut. It was closer to a flour tortilla or a piece of pan than a loaf of bread.

which -- (CW) The word translated as "which" is the Greek definite article, without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more.

cometh -- (WF) -- The verb translated as "comes down" means "go down," but root word means "steps" so, with the prefix, the sense is "steps down," which I find more poetic. When speaking of the sky, we say in English that things "come down" not "go down." This form here is not an active verb but a participle, "stepping down."

down  - The "down" is from the prefix of the verb that means "down."

from -- The Greek preposition translated as "from" means "out of" or "from."

missing "the"  -- (MW) The untranslated word is the Greek definite article, which usually precedes a noun and, without a noun, takes the meaning of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those"). See this article for more. 

heaven, -- The word translated as "heaven" means "sky," the "climate," and the "universe." It also meant the home of the gods in a physical sense: the sun, moon, and planets were named for the gods. More about the word in this article.

that -- The word translated as "that" is an adverb "in that place," "there," "where," "when," or as a conjunction that starts a subordinate clause  "that," "when," "in order that" or "because."

a -- There is no indefinite article in Greek, but when a word doesn't have a definite article, the indefinite article can be added in English translation.

man --  (WW) The Greek word translated as "man" in the singular means "anyone," "someone,"  "something," and "anything." In the plural, it means "some," "they," and "those."  This is not the word for "man."

may -- This helping verb "may" indicates that the verb indicates a possibility, the subjunctive. Helping or auxiliary verbs are needed to translate the Greek verb forms into English.

eat -- The word translated as "ye shall eat" means "eat" but it also means "fret," as we say "something is eating me up."

there- -- The word translated as "there" is the Greek word commonly translated as third-person pronouns in English.

of, -- The Greek preposition translated as "of" means "out of" or "from." In Greek, they use the genitive case instead of a preposition for the types of phrases the "of" phrases.

and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also"). In a series, it is can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as."

not -- The negative used here is the Greek negative of a subjective opinion, commands, and requests. The sense is that "you don't want" or "think" something, not that it isn't done or thought. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause.  It is the negative used with verbs of possibility, actions that "might" or "should" happen because that is an opinion. That is why it is used here.

missing "should" or "might"-- (MW) A helping verb is necessary because the following verb is a verb of possibility, a subjunctive, something that "should" or "might" occur. The helping verb is not needed in a clause beginning with an "if" or a "when."

die. - "Die" is a Greek verb that means "to die" and "to die off." Since the root word also means "to die," and the prefix means "away," the sense is to "die away" or to "die off."

EACH WORD of NIV

But -- (IW) There is nothing that can be translated as "but" in the Greek source.

here   -- (CW) "Here" is translated from a Greek adjective that means "this," "that," "the nearer." Without a noun, it has the sense of "this one" or "that one." It is in the form of a subject. This is not the word for "here."

is -- The verb "is" here is the common form of "to be" in Greek. It means to have a certain characteristic or remain in a certain condition. It also equates terms or assigns characteristics.

the -- The word translated as "the" is the Greek definite article, without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more. 

bread -- The word translated as "bread" means "small loaf or cake of bread." It is more like a slice of bread today. It describes a thin 1/2 inch thick round or an oblong loaf of wheat bread, meant to be torn into pieces and not cut. It was closer to a flour tortilla or a piece of pan than a loaf of bread.

that -- (CW) The word translated as "that " is the Greek definite article, without a noun, it has the sense of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those") than the English "the." See this article for more.

comes -- (WF) -- The verb translated as "comes down" means "go down," but root word means "steps" so, with the prefix, the sense is "steps down," which I find more poetic. When speaking of the sky, we say in English that things "come down" not "go down." This form here is not an active verb but a participle, "stepping down."

down  - The "down" is from the prefix of the verb that means "down."

from -- The Greek preposition translated as "from" means "out of" or "from."

missing "the"  -- (MW) The untranslated word is the Greek definite article, which usually precedes a noun and, without a noun, takes the meaning of "the one." The Greek article is much closer to our demonstrative pronouns ("this," "that," "these," "those"). See this article for more. 

heaven, -- The word translated as "heaven" means "sky," the "climate," and the "universe." It also meant the home of the gods in a physical sense: the sun, moon, and planets were named for the gods. More about the word in this article.

which -- (CW) The word translated as "which " is an adverb "in that place," "there," "where," "when," or as a conjunction that starts a subordinate clause  "that," "when," "in order that" or "because."

anyone --  (WW) The Greek word translated as "anyone " in the singular means "anyone," "someone,"  "something," and "anything." In the plural, it means "some," "they," and "those."  This is not the word for "man."

may -- This helping verb "may" indicates that the verb indicates a possibility, the subjunctive. Helping or auxiliary verbs are needed to translate the Greek verb forms into English.

eat -- The word translated as "ye shall eat" means "eat" but it also means "fret," as we say "something is eating me up."

missing "from"  -- (MW) The untranslated word"from" means "out of" or "from."

missing "it"  -- (MW) The untranslated word "it" is the Greek word commonly translated as third-person pronouns in English.  

and -- The Greek word translated as "and" is used as the conjunction "and," but it also is used to add emphasis ("also"). In a series, it is can be translated as "not only...but also." After words implying sameness "as."

not -- The negative used here is the Greek negative of a subjective opinion, commands, and requests. The sense is that "you don't want" or "think" something, not that it isn't done or thought. When a negative precedes the verb, it affects the whole clause.  It is the negative used with verbs of possibility, actions that "might" or "should" happen because that is an opinion. That is why it is used here.

missing "should" or "might"-- (MW) A helping verb is necessary because the following verb is a verb of possibility, a subjunctive, something that "should" or "might" occur. The helping verb is not needed in a clause beginning with an "if" or a "when."

die. - "Die" is a Greek verb that means "to die" and "to die off." Since the root word also means "to die," and the prefix means "away," the sense is to "die away" or to "die off."

COMPARISON: GREEK to KJV

οὗτός [83 verses](adj sg masc nom) "This" is houtos, which as an adjective means "this," "that," "the nearer." 

ἐστίν.[614 verses](3rd sg pres ind act) "Is" is eimi, which means "to be," "to exist," "to be the case," of circumstance and events "to happen,"  and "is possible." With the genitive object, the sense is "belongs to." It can also mean "must" with a dative.

[821 verses](article sg masc nom)  "The" is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the"). 

ἄρτος [32 verses](noun sg masc nom)"Bread" is artos, which means specifically a "cake of whole wheat bread," and generally "loaf," and "bread."

[821 verses](article sg masc nom)  "Which" is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the").  

ἐκ [121 verses] (prep) "From" is ek, which means 1) [of motion] "out of," "from," "by," "away from;" 2) [of place] "beyond," "outside of," "beyond;" 3) [of succession] "after," "from;" 4) [of rest] "on," "in," 5) [of time] "since," "from," "at," "in;" 5) [of materials] "out of," "made from;" 6) cause, instrument, or means "by."

τοῦ[821 verses](article sg masc gen)  Untranslated is the Greek definite article, hos, ("the"). 

οὐρανοῦ [111 verses](noun sg masc gen) "Of Heaven" is the Greek ouranos, which means "heaven as in the vault of the sky," "heaven as the seat of the gods," "the sky," "the universe," and "the climate."

καταβαίνων [26 verses](part sg pres act masc nom) "Came down" is katabaino, which means "go down," "come down from," and "dismount from." Metaphorically, it means "attain," "conform to," "condescend," "fall in value," and "arrive at the end [of a speech]."

ἵνα [134 verses](adv/conj) "That" is hina, which means "in that place," "there," "where," "when,"  but when beginning a phrase "that," "in order that," "when," and "because."

τις [252 verses](pron sg dat) "A man" is tis which can mean "someone," "something," "any one," "everyone," "they [indefinite]," "many a one," "whoever," "anyone," "anything," "some sort," "some sort of," "each," "any," "the individual," "such," and so on. In a question, it can mean "who," "why," or "what."

ἐξ [121 verses] (prep) "-of" is ek, which means 1) [of motion] "out of," "from," "by," "away from;" 2) [of place] "beyond," "outside of," "beyond;" 3) [of succession] "after," "from;" 4) [of rest] "on," "in," 5) [of time] "since," "from," "at," "in;" 5) [of materials] "out of," "made from;" 6) cause, instrument, or means "by."

αὐτοῦ [720 verses](adj sg masc gen) "There-"  is autos, which means "the same," and the reflexive pronouns, "myself," "yourself," "himself," "herself," "itself," or the oblique case of the pronouns, "him," "her," and "it." It also means "one's true self," that is, "the soul" as opposed to the body and "of one's own accord." In the adverbial form, it  means "just here" or "exactly there."

φάγῃκαὶ [30 verses](3rd sg aor subj act) "May eat" is esthio, which means "to eat," "devour," "fret," "vex," and to "take in one's mouth." It is also a metaphor for decay and erosion.

καὶ [1089 verses](conj/adv) "And" is kai, which is the conjunction joining phrases and clauses, "and," or "also." After words implying sameness, "as" (the same opinion as you). Used in series, joins positive with negative "Not only...but also." Also used to give emphasis, "even," "also," and "just."

μὴ [447 verses](conj) "Not" is me , which is the negative used in prohibitions and expressions of doubt meaning "not" and "no." As οὐ (ou) negates fact and statement; μή rejects, οὐ denies; μή is relative, οὐ absolute; μή subjective, οὐ objective. With pres. or aor. subj. used in a warning or statement of fear, "take care" It can be the conjunction "lest" or "for fear that." Used before tis with an imperative to express a will or wish for something in independent sentences and, with subjunctives, to express prohibitions.

ἀποθάνῃ [14 verses] (3rd sg aor subj act) "Die" is from apothnesko, which means "to die" and "to die off." 

Possible Symbolic Meaning
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